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He's Packing His Bags Saturday
By confidence
9/9/2011 3:19:50 AM
*This whole conversation I stayed calm and loving. I did cry a little off/on.

So, he told me he's packing his bags on Saturday. He reminded me that he will provide for us, but won't live with me. I asked him and told him I deserve to have a clear answer of why, and he said it didn't matter. Finally I said, "Well, is it because of my boundaries with my body and how you feel that that means I don't love you?" And he said, "Yeah, I guess that is it."

I reminded him this has to do with me feeling safe, that because of the SA, he has to treat touching me as a privilege (again - like when we were dating). He said that he didn't agree with that and since he married me, that I am his wife, that it shouldn't be something he has to "beg" for. Of course I clarified and said I never said "beg," but ask. I told him my plan was never to keep physical touch away from him, only to protect me and keep me safe in my mind and heart - it's not like he's never going to get to hold my hand etc again or something. But, he said I was lying and that I was only doing it to hurt him - or basically "get back" at him. Honestly, there is no way that is something I am meaning to do at all.

I reminded him that I loved him, what I loved about him, that I will not tell him when to leave (he'd asked me to tell him when...? weird), that this was all about safety etc.

Anyway, I'm trying to be sooo good right now, but I want to cry and cry and freak out. I AM HERE WITH HIM AFTER HE'S HAVING SEX (W/ HIMSELF AND IMAGES) BEHIND MY BACK FOR 11 YEARS!!! Why the h*ll did I even invest in that if he's throwing this pity party and leaving because of this safety rule??? He still kept saying that *I* must not want to heal together.

I know with ever ounce of my heart, this physical boundary was not set to hurt him, I am here to heal with him and by myself as well. I don't want him to beg for sex or physical touch, I want him to ask as I am a daughter of God that deserves to feel like a gem that is precious enough to respect when I have that type of boundary for me to feel ok/safe. I'm so glad I didn't yell (he didn't either, but had a monotone voice and very hateful, spiritless face/stare the whole time). Of course he says he's not sleeping in bed with me anymore.

Comments:

Good! Let him go.    
"Stand your ground, Sister! He's being manipulative and controlling like a typical abuser. I would tell him to not let the door hit him on the way out. On Saturday, remind him that he said he was leaving. You don't need to keep explaining yourself to him. He has no interest in healing together, as he said. His only motive is to control the situation.

Keep up the good work. I know it is really hard. Make your own plans for Saturday. Get busy with your own healing to strengthen your resolve. I bet there's a meeting or some kind of support group on Sat.

Don't give up, Confidence! Have you found a counselor or therapist you can do business with yet?"
posted at 04:33:05 on September 9, 2011 by Anonymous
More confusion...    
"About 30 min after typing this up here, he had some leg cramp last night on the couch and made some noises. Of course I was still awake. I didn't know it was him, and actually thought it was someone else, so I turned on the hallway light, paused, and slowly made my way down to see "who" it was. He gently told me sorry about making noise, and sorry if he scared me. He actually initiated touching me on my arm while saying this. I told him he did scare me and what was going on. He told me about the leg cramp, again he's sorry he scared me, and he hopes I have gotten some sleep. He then went to the bathroom. I stood outside the door and when he came out, I touched his arm, telling him that I'm surprise he's letting me do that, and I guess it will be the last time I'll be able to do that.

I told him that I hadn't been able to sleep because I can't believe he's leaving. He said (calmly again) that he really wants me to get some sleep, and beckoned me to our bedroom. He said he wanted to be next to me so I could go to sleep. I told him that didn't make sense to me as he's been so against being with me in any way since my boundaries got in place. He kept firm (in this same gentle way) that he just wanted to help me sleep as he knows I usually have slept much better with him in the room with me. I was bewildered and tired too. I didn't have a care either way if he went back to the couch, or was next to me. So, I just let us lay in bed. I cried and cried (still). I told him, again, that I was not setting my boundaries to kill his heart, but to protect mine. That I can't believe that would make him leave. He told me we'd talk about it tomorrow (actually today at this point). Again, this went back and forth as I was just crying, confused, and tired enough to not be thinking about what I was doing/saying until now. He stayed CALMLY firm in his want to "talk about it tomorrow." He never said he wasn't leaving when I referenced it though.

So, at this point, I'm thinking, I was acting so weepy cause I'm feeling shot in the back again, and it was like 4 in the morning so I wasn't really on top of myself and my words to him, in particular. I'm giving myself space instead of blame for that.

I did say something profound for my own reference last night. "The day you told me you are leaving and want a divorce is the 2nd most painful day of my life. The first was me finding out about your SA."

RE: Therapist - yes. We have both been just starting phase 2 of Lifestar. The therapist that leads my group is a past therapist of ours that we both just adore. I saw her once, but then realized the weekly meet ups help enough. But, with this, I will make an appointment today, and hopefully get in soon."
posted at 09:06:40 on September 9, 2011 by confidence
More confusion...    
"About 30 min after typing this up here, he had some leg cramp last night on the couch and made some noises. Of course I was still awake. I didn't know it was him, and actually thought it was someone else, so I turned on the hallway light, paused, and slowly made my way down to see "who" it was. He gently told me sorry about making noise, and sorry if he scared me. He actually initiated touching me on my arm while saying this. I told him he did scare me and what was going on. He told me about the leg cramp, again he's sorry he scared me, and he hopes I have gotten some sleep. He then went to the bathroom. I stood outside the door and when he came out, I touched his arm, telling him that I'm surprise he's letting me do that, and I guess it will be the last time I'll be able to do that.

I told him that I hadn't been able to sleep because I can't believe he's leaving. He said (calmly again) that he really wants me to get some sleep, and beckoned me to our bedroom. He said he wanted to be next to me so I could go to sleep. I told him that didn't make sense to me as he's been so against being with me in any way since my boundaries got in place. He kept firm (in this same gentle way) that he just wanted to help me sleep as he knows I usually have slept much better with him in the room with me. I was bewildered and tired too. I didn't have a care either way if he went back to the couch, or was next to me. So, I just let us lay in bed. I cried and cried (still). I told him, again, that I was not setting my boundaries to kill his heart, but to protect mine. That I can't believe that would make him leave. He told me we'd talk about it tomorrow (actually today at this point). Again, this went back and forth as I was just crying, confused, and tired enough to not be thinking about what I was doing/saying until now. He stayed CALMLY firm in his want to "talk about it tomorrow." He never said he wasn't leaving when I referenced it though.

So, at this point, I'm thinking, I was acting so weepy cause I'm feeling shot in the back again, and it was like 4 in the morning so I wasn't really on top of myself and my words to him, in particular. I'm giving myself space instead of blame for that.

I did say something profound for my own reference last night. "The day you told me you are leaving and want a divorce is the 2nd most painful day of my life. The first was me finding out about your SA."

RE: Therapist - yes. We have both been just starting phase 2 of Lifestar. The therapist that leads my group is a past therapist of ours that we both just adore. I saw her once, but then realized the weekly meet ups help enough. But, with this, I will make an appointment today, and hopefully get in soon."
posted at 09:35:38 on September 9, 2011 by confidence
Confusion    
"Is not from God. Your husband's behavior is typical addict behavior and it will get crazier the more you keep your boundaries in place. Blame the victim in the name of the game. You must be strong in Christ if you hope to begin healing. You need him out so as to clear your head. This is the time you need to trust God with him leaving may be the beginning of him understanding the truth of what he has done to you. Do not stand in the way of God's work with him. Codependents often slow God's work with a loved one by stepping in. Tell him to leave. He needs to think and he needs to find the Savior.

The very strong feelings you had when you set these boundaries were of God, don't doubt and have faith. What iis happening is part of the great plan.

Let's say you were sick, so sick for an extended period of time and could not have sex with him. Would he love and serve you anyway? or would he pack his bags and say you don't love him. Well, you are sick. His addiction made you sick and you need time to heal. if he becomes humble and non-manipulating you will know it.

Let him go and trust God. Change the locks so that he knows that he cannot just walk in anytime. Your relationship is not stable, and for peace of mind, I would re-key the locks. He will not understand any of this because he is an addict who is still sick. Don't beg him to understand. He will only understand when he is left alone to understand and that is when he falls on his knees and comes too the knowlege the damage he has done.

I promise, I know what I am talking about, I have been there. My husband now understands and we are together working out our marriage and eternal salvation together. he respects my boundaries and knows I love him."
posted at 10:15:48 on September 9, 2011 by Anonymous
I think you are doing the right thing    
"I really want to support you and tell you that I think that you are taking the right road in your calm attitude. This is just another form of him 'acting out' because this is all part of his addiction and disease. Do not let yourself fall into the trap. Stay the course you are on. I would take the kids and leave at the time that he has set to 'pack his bags'. Somehow I doubt that he will actually do it, but I would take the kids to the park or something just so there is no drama if he does go.

You set an amazing and righteous and healthy and wonderful, perfect, appropriate boundary and he is fighting it. Let him choose to leave without fighting him or getting sucked into his games. He doesn't consciously know he is even manipulating you probably. He just knows that with you setting boundaries and changing that things/he can't stay the same. Something has got to give and if he is not ready for that to be him changing then he'll try stuff like this.

You are doing the right thing. That means you are giving your marriage the best change. You aren't hurting him, you are helping him. You aren't causing pain you are setting the stage for real healing to happen. I am so proud of you. I wish I knew how to really do the type of things that you are doing. It is so easy seeing from the outside that what you are doing is right. I hope to take some of this in to my own circumstances.

Stay calm. Stay Christlike. You are doing it! You are on the road. Way to go! And keep us posted. Just remember to protect yourself because if he is bringing this much drama now, when he realizes you aren't taking the bait then it may get worse before it gets better. Hang in there and way to go!"
posted at 10:58:13 on September 9, 2011 by maddy
Confidence,    
"He's got you right where he wants you. Now he controls the situation. But you can re-assert the boundary and still follow through by doing the things Maddy and Anon posted.

That's ok. We're just learning. Boundaries are HARD! There's always a desperate attempt to grab control away from the person putting their foot down. If we're ready to follow through with the consequences we don't have to engage in their drama. We just stand our ground.

I went through something similar and it was painful. But it taught me that my need for approval was like an addiction in the damage it caused my self-esteem. I learned that I needed to work the 12 Steps for my own healing. Through working the Steps I discovered that these issues existed in me long before I met my husband. I saw a pattern in myself. I would go to great lengths to seek the approval of people who were unworthy of my love. This is one of the definitions of codependence.

Stand your ground, Sister. Let him leave."
posted at 11:11:33 on September 9, 2011 by Anonymous
Stay Strong! "True Love in the form of Self Respect!"    
"Pray for the spirit to guide you and keep a prayer in your heart constantly. Pray for angels to protect you and your family. Pray that you will have the courage to follow the promptings of the Spirit and the Will of the Father.

Remember, the Spirit does not drive it leads.

You are fighting for a righteous cause. Your family. You will feel the support of the Father, His son, our older brother, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost. Lean on them. They know you, and they know your husband.

Keep your righteous boundaries. And to quote from another wise sister from this site, angelmom, " I no longer react in guilt and fear. I use true love in the form of self respect. He is learning, and I feel nothing but love and peace. God is changing me, and he will change you too."

Prayers,"
posted at 12:22:05 on September 9, 2011 by hero
Thanks    
"Thank you all for your prayers and thoughts. They are helping me form a clearer picture while I am reminded to listen to the Spirit lead me.

Hero, I wrote what Angelmom said above my "Jesus box" drawing on our bathroom mirror. A new affirmation! :)"
posted at 12:58:02 on September 9, 2011 by confidence
Thinking of you    
"I wanted to come on here and tell you that I am thinking of you today and sending a prayer that no matter what, you'll have the peace you need today."
posted at 11:07:25 on September 10, 2011 by maddy
Pray    
"All of the comments and opinions here are fine and supportive, but they are just that opinions.

Let the spirit guide you."
posted at 17:26:23 on September 11, 2011 by ruggaexpat
You are 100% wrong    
"You could not be more wrong in creating a boundary there. You are only making his problem worse. You are supposed to be supportive. Telling him he cannot touch you is not supportive. Physical touch between a husband and wife is one of the most essential parts of the relationship and communicates love and support and emotional connection. If you take that away it will seriously mess with his psychology and will only drive him further into pornography.

That being said, he is completely wrong in leaving.

Having a pornography addiction? yeah, hes wrong, but thats not really that big of a deal. The worst thing a woman can do in a marriage is make a big deal of that because its really not.

Is it a sin? yes. does he need to stop? yes. Should you treat him like he is on drugs? no.

Pornography addiction in men is like food addiction in women. What would you say if I told my wife that she couldnt touch me because she ate too much? If I said "you dont get to touch me because your fat disgusts me." That is what you are saying to him. Sure maybe the fat disgusts you, but dont make things harder than they need to be."
posted at 01:10:32 on September 14, 2011 by Porojukaha
all these people commenting are also wrong    
"Just thought that I would say that everyone else who is commenting is also wrong. How many divorces have you guys seen because of sexual addiction? I have seen a LOT and every single time that a woman starts to withdraw from her husband because of the addiction it drives him further into depression and dependence. EVERY SINGLE TIME. Turn the other cheek sister."
posted at 01:12:56 on September 14, 2011 by Porojukaha
Did you think this problem would end overnight?    
"Also, you have been married 11 years and hes had this problem the whole time. Likely hes had the problem for MUCH longer than that, hes probably had it longer than you have known him, much longer than that. I wouldnt be surprised to learn that hes had it since he was 12 years old. Especially considering the fact that around 75%(thats a conservative estimate) of all male members of the church struggle with pornography addiction at one point in their lives. How do I know? because I know a lot of male members of the church well and I know a lot of bishops and I have seen a lot of divorces, met a lot of excommunicated people (pornography is not an excommunicatable offense). I have a lot of experience when it comes to these things.

Hes not going to just up and get fixed especially from something that is so addicting. This is going to take him at least a year, probably more time than that.

all that time you are going to need to be supportive in every way you can and let him know you love him. Ever heard that YOUR ACTIONS SPEAK SO LOUD I CANT HEAR WHAT YOU SAY. ?
well, your NOT TOUCHING HIM is an ACTION that will speak much LOUDER than you saying you are supportive. I would go so far as to say that you are lying when you say it. No matter what you say, if you do not touch him, you are not being supportive.

One of the best things you could do in fact would be to try to have regular sex with him. Men and women have urges, especially men. If those urges dont have a healthy outlet then they are probably going to be let out somehow.

Pornography and masturbation is more addicting than heroin. its a medical fact. Now, its not as serious a problem because there really are no victims besides the user and the users spouse and the users spouse isn't really all that harmed no matter how harmed she wants to think she is. At worst their sex life wont be what it was and she will feel somewhat betrayed. Thats not all that bad if you consider what it does to the man. Addiction to pornography takes away a mans priesthood, it robs him of the spirit it takes away all confidence that he has before god, it destroys his self confidence. It often leads to self loathing, depression and can even lead to suicide. It can cause him to lose emotional feeling. When you have a really strong addiction to pornography the feelings inside you are like hell on earth. The crushing shame, yet the inability to stop. Its like trying not to breathe. But its still not a big problem because only the man is really hurt and if he wants to get fixed there are ways to do that.

1. Wife must be supportive
2. Go to 12 step
3. See your bishop regularly
4. see a professional counselor

Now what is a problem is that these things can lead to the man cheating on his wife or vice versa which is a HUGE problem.

In fact Christ himself said that the only thing that should ever remove the closeness of a man and wife is adultery. That includes physical closeness. Until he cheats on you you should not withold touch. You shouldnt even stop having sex.

Now I will say that I suffer from an addiction to pornography myself and I know that is going to make you say that you cant trust what i am saying. But in reality think about it. It means you CAN trust what I am saying because I actually have experience with these things!!! Unlike the people I have seen posting above who seem to have no idea what they are talking about and who are all obviously women who have not even had their husbands go through something like this.

I know lots of people that have overcome it but I myself keep slipping up sometimes and its because I was too prideful to do what the people who I know have conquered the problem do. I thought I didnt need 12 step, that I could do it on my own. I am now going to 12 step.

But I cant say it enough. TRUST ME you are helping to destroy a celestial marriage. dont do it!!!"
posted at 01:33:15 on September 14, 2011 by Porojukaha
Wow Porojukaha    
"You need help. Obviously dear brother, you do not get it.

The first rule in supporting a loved one is to set boundaries and if a woman does not feel safe with an addict, she needs to do whatever she can to stay safe. Withholding sex as a punishment to her husband is wrong. Withholding sex to protect her heart is right.

You need to understand the difference between carnal sex and God like intimacy in a eternal marriage. A marriage built on trust. A porn addict husband has broken that trust and I thank the dear Lord that my husband gets it and is a real man. Because he get's it our marriage and yes, intimacy is better than ever.

You are right about one thing. A carnal man of the world needs sex. A man of God, a real man, honors his priesthood and nurtures his wife's tender heart and protects her as his God would expect. He loves her and puts her wants and needs above his own. A really smart man who honors his priesthood understands that in God's plan, he does not seek out porn and then act it out on his wife, which completely disconnects him from the very closeness both him and his wife desire.

Please seek help. I feel so sad for your wife right now because if she is doing as you suggest, it will come back to bite you and her as soon as she comes out of denial . I am guessing that her cheeks and very red by now. I have been in this game a long time and just because you want it to be "no big deal", does not mean that God is going along with your plan.

If you attend the temple, it is very clear that in God's eyes, Porn is a VERY bid deal.

Pornography is pure evil. It messes with the very powers that were God given, and as proven by your very insensitive words, Satan is very good at deceiving.

Repent dear brother. We all need to repent and you are no exception.

I am just about to say my evening prayers and I will pray for you and your wife. I will pray that your eyes may be opened to the damage you are causing your wife and children.

Please humble yourself and save your family."
posted at 01:47:08 on September 14, 2011 by Anonymous
You do not know anything    
"What a prideful man. Pornography is cheating and I know for a fact that you can be ex-ed for it. Just ask some of the men on this post who have lost their membership because of this evil sin.

You are a woman abuser and hater and it shows in your very selfish and hurtful post. Please go away until you grow a pair buddy. You are not welcome here with such degrading comments."
posted at 01:57:03 on September 14, 2011 by Anonymous
Classic denial and minimization.    
"It's so crazy how we think we know everything when we are still at the stage that we can't put a single day of clean time. The natural reaction is to minimize the problem because it is just too immense to fathom.

Porojukaha, There is hope, Bro. There is a solution to this beast that has stolen our will."
posted at 02:06:39 on September 14, 2011 by Anonymous
Porojukaha-Brother    
"Your comments about Pn addiction bring me sadness You are a young man who has much to learn. You are young and inexperienced. Read the words of men and women on this post and you will see more truth here than just about anywhere else. You will learn more about sadness and hope, the power of Satan, and the awesome power of Jesus Christ who can crush him, and about how important it is in a marriage to have trust, and what happens when there isn't any.

I want you to know that after decades of this addiction and because of the lack of true protection (spiritual protection thru the holy priesthood), my family had been destroyed forever. There is repentance, however, you can never re-do what has already been done.

We are trying to pick up the pieces of our lives and go on now. If you go into any talk by the GAs on the subject, they all say the same thing. "Don't even look once", "look away", "do not touch it". "IT WILL DESTROY YOU".

I am not sure where you are getting your information, but I assure you it is not coming from God. PORNOGRAPHY IS NEVER HARMLESS, NEVER EVER!!!

We are moving forward in our lives and feel the blessings of our amazing Savior Jesus Christ. But what started years ago as a thought of "it's not hurting anyone", "no one knows", or, "i'm not getting enough sex from my wife", has now put my family on a course and life change that I would not wish on my worse enemy.

Your list for sobriety is this:

1. Wife must be supportive
2. Go to 12 step
3. See your bishop regularly
4. see a professional counselorI want to suggest a new list for you

Based upon years of pain heaped upon my family by the power of the destroyer which was let into our lives by invitation (thru porn) I would like to revise your list a bit:

1. Jesus Christ is my Savior, not my wife- I have to help her, not the other way around.
2. Attend 12 step- more important, personally work your steps every day, never skipping EVER
4. Pray, serve, no secrets- none, Daily repentance and see your Bishop as necessary. Call your sponsor every day
5 A professional who specializes in sex and porn addiction (I add one who is Christ centered)
6. GIVE YOUR LIFE AND YOUR AGENCY TO JESUS CHRIST AND TESTIFY OF HIS GOODNESS AND MERCY ALL DAY, EVERYDAY!!!

I wish you only the best in this life. Welcome to a new life should you choose sobriety. For if you embrace the true Lord and your true Savior, you will become new in him and the "natural man" will be put away, and you will be born again."
posted at 07:39:26 on September 14, 2011 by Anonymous
Porojukaha -- we are here to validate and support...    
"Your comments cause me a lot of anxiety and hurt. To be effective, this place needs to be like SAA or PSAG and needs to be a safe place where someone can receive support. All of this stuff is painful. People will stop sharing if it becomes unsafe.

i personally hear the pain that Confidence is feeling and I see a lot of the same pain from my own perspective as an addict. This stuff sucks! I wouldnt wish it on anyone.

Telling people what they "should" do is a invitiation to rejection -- even if you are right. People need to come up with their own answers..

confidence -- we love you!!! Keep putting up the good fight.

Poro -- we will love you too. Welcome. Good luck with your fight."
posted at 10:50:46 on September 14, 2011 by Anonymous
Recovery is....    
"I recently heard a man and women's recovery described this way.

Recovery for a man is his willingness to fight for his wife's heart. Recovery for a women is her willingness to open her heart.

As humans we need emotional connection. It is a neccesity of life. Addiction is a connection disorder, those that are addicted have used other means (synthetic means) to try and get that connection. These means are typically quick fixes that don't satisfy the need for true union, but rather increase the appetite or hunger for connection. A women / wife has her own ways of acting out. Withdrawl, or aggression can be forms.

This tread reminds me of the story of the prodigal son. You have a son that returns and then you have a son that never strayed. The son that never strayed realizes that he has some work to do in his own life, even though he (in his mind) never did anything wrong. He was faithful, he didn't leave the family and spoil the inheritance. His problems though were different. He eventually realizes that he needs the Savior just as much as the wayward son."
posted at 12:04:05 on September 14, 2011 by jblackb
So hard    
"My heart aches for you!! I am so sorry that you have to endure this.
I separated at one point with my husband and it gave me time to focus just on me and my kids. I didn't live with all the fears and anxieties that I did living under the same roof with him.
If a person sinks further into porn and depression because of not having physical contact with you- its not your fault. I am sure we have all had enough therapists tell us that people have to change for themselves. If he changes only for you- and it never goes any deeper- it wont last. It has to be that HE DECIDES HE WANTS IT. And its hard to sit back and watch and see what he decides.
You are a daughter of God and you deserve to be treated as such. It is a 2 way street and it takes so much work with marriage. Most of us spouses- we carry more of the load. And it drains you. I am so sorry.
Its not fair for them to place any blame on us as a spouse.
Thoughts and prayers with you!! Much love"
posted at 14:24:35 on September 14, 2011 by faith21
RE: POROJUKAHA, RE: All posters - more thoughts    
"Wow. Because of my boundaries, and understanding and accepting more and more that I am a beloved daughter of a Heavenly King, my Heavenly Father, the negative posts didn't affect me. This is BIG for me. :) Thank you all for your supportive posts. I do know I'm glad I didn't see these posts from POROJUKAHA until now.

Poro, I feel such sadness for your wife, and for you. Seek the light of the Gospel in this matter. Search the scriptures, read conference talks on these things. You will be blessed beyond measure through time and faith.

I have set this physical boundary to be SAFE. I am NOT in ANYWAY trying to "let him have it." As I've stated in other posts (and I think this one?), I ENJOY and have initiated sex with him as eternal companions sharing our TRUE love for one another. I have been getting many comments from my husband about how he needs it because he's having a hard time fighting this addiction. The other night, he said he needed it so he can be calm at work tomorrow. These are not advances for spiritual sex with his beloved wife; but ways to get his "fix" that he's had before when he's had sex with himself and images before.

As a daughter of God, I deserve safety from the one I was sealed for time and all eternity with. I deserve an honest husband. He deserves an honest wife and safety and respect too. But, when those things are broken, and his SA rates so much higher than his wife, he lies, he betrays, he flirts and goes out to lunch with other women, that safety I thought I had is gone. My mind, body and soul tell me that that was not ok, and the PTSD from it keeps telling me (w/o my knowing... it just comes) that he's not safe. I keep prayer at hand always now so that I can check in with my loving Heavenly Father to see what I should do in every facet of my life now - especially for the PTSD and learning to love and accept myself."
posted at 16:55:57 on September 14, 2011 by confidence
You are making great progress Confidence!    
"Great post! Thak you for keeping us updated. I am so thankful that you could see through PORO's posts. When we have the Spirit with us, we here the truth!

Prayers to you and your righteous boundaries!"
posted at 18:04:44 on September 14, 2011 by Hero
He's young and naive...    
"I think we just need to treat him like we would a sick friend. (However obnoxious this friend may be)"
posted at 18:12:32 on September 14, 2011 by Anonymous
Beware of emotions    
"It's so sad that porn has to cause such division and contention within ourselves, within relationships, within families, within churches.. and on this site.

sometimes I think we just all need a break... every 7 days sounds about right... to rest from all the thinking...the analyzing... the praying... the bitterness.. the emotional drama.

we're all human beings.
we're all struggling
we all need God's love and grace and mercy like it's the air we breathe.

but sometimes.. we just need to chill out... and be thankful for what do we have in life.
satan is the ultimate trickster... and sometimes like a judo master... will get our energy going one way.. and then reverse on us... to try and pry us lose from our position.

I pray that we can all be still and Know God is right in the middle of all this:

we can't
he can
lets let him!!!"
posted at 18:32:03 on September 14, 2011 by gracefull
Your husband needs....    
"He needs to learn how to fight for your heart. Your most recent post makes it very clear that he doesn't have any desire to be in recovery! If your husband is open to a conversation I would love to speak with him and introduce the SA program, and share a few of my own experiences. Sobriety and then recovery is a tough path. It isn't a cafeteria plan you can't pick and choose what works best for you. There is really only one path, and it is pretty narrow, with a nice sized ditch that runs right along the edge."
posted at 18:33:07 on September 14, 2011 by jblackb
Confidence    
"You are just so awesome. I have seen so much change in your posts over the weeks. At first you seemed to have a lot of frustration and fear and now you are just full of, well, CONFIDENCE! You are so clearly on the right track. I am so happy for you and it brings me strength."
posted at 19:35:10 on September 14, 2011 by maddy
Guys for goodness sake    
"Porojukaha has just arrived to this great place and although he is green behind the ears does he need to be treated like this? The guy could use some direction without the smart arse remarks.

Anon I repeated this same request to someone else posting under the anon cloud.

Have a bit more respect, don't venture to tell a newbie to hit the road and certainly don't get so personal.

Seriously let people say what the hell they wish to say as much as we all need to say what we wish to say ourselves.

This is happening much too often now.

Porojukaha - I cannot be more clear than this - this is the most evil sin on the face of the planet because it has distanced me from my family and the Lord more than anything else. This is why it is so evil.
As you gain more knowledge and heal more, you will stop the justifications and rationalizations and realize change is possible when you reread your comments above a few months/years later. Stick around, this place needs your energy."
posted at 21:58:38 on September 14, 2011 by ruggaexpat
Rugga,    
"Yes, like you said why don't we let people say whatever it is they need to say without YOU attacking them. We all know how you feel about anonymous posters but why not take your OWN advice."
posted at 04:16:48 on September 15, 2011 by Anonymous
Most evil sin on the face of the planet?    
"Sorry, but I don't think porn is the most evil sin on the face of the planet, although it certainly can lead to that type of sin. I think porn addicts need to admit that they're sinning and get help, but wallowing around in how "terrible" the sin is does not help anyone.

Besides, porn doesn't hold a candle to what this lady did -

"Killpack was found guilty of a second-degree felony in 2005 for forcing her adopted daughter to drink about a gallon of water, resulting in the girl's death. Killpack's conviction could have kept her in prison for up to 15 years, but in January she requested that she be permitted to go home.

Read more: < http://www.heraldextra.com/news/local/south/springville/article_9e774f97-824f-5360-b122-a4f199c46924.html#ixzz1Y3KTd8FZ >

If you ask me, Killpack should be taken to the gallows, not given parole."
posted at 14:54:35 on September 15, 2011 by Anonymous
Nice and easy there now tiger    
"Dude or dudette or whatever in blogs name you call yourself, thank you for giving me yet another reason to confirm my belief.

I won't repeat it because I happily noticed you have a sufficient awareness."
posted at 15:15:20 on September 15, 2011 by ruggaexpat
Magnificent another sin hierarchy discussion    
"This was discussed a while ago.
You want to think it is number 2 or 50 on your list - knock yourself out.
Based on the damage it caused my family - it is number one by a long way."
posted at 15:33:14 on September 15, 2011 by ruggaexpat
You're welcome.    
"Glad I could help."
posted at 16:57:00 on September 15, 2011 by Anonymous
Spinning Your Wheels    
"Rugga!

Dont you have anything better to do than argue with nameless, faceless phantoms on an addiction recovery site?"
posted at 03:00:51 on September 16, 2011 by Anonymous
Nah not really Anon    
"I think I read some place that my life had become unmanageable."
posted at 14:07:21 on September 18, 2011 by ruggaexpat


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"One of the false notions of our society is that we are victims of our appetites and passions. But the truth is that the body is controlled by the spirit which inhabits it."

— Terrance D. Olson

“Teaching Morality to Your Children,” Ensign, Mar. 1981